103 posts in this topic

17 hours ago, Hungry said:

While I encourage anyone who has ideas to continuing commenting on this thread, it is just becoming a sea of ideas and we need to focus on the here and now of the site so I took the liberity of reaching out to @la-femme in PM. See below:

Hi,

The topic has brought up many interesting points, but it's just becoming a sea of ideas, which is not going to help the site unless we focus on the here and now. Please let me know if the money gets taken and you hear from the 1&1/service providers. I think the best thing we can do for now in order to keep the site is continue to fund it.

It'll be easier to work towards if you're willing to share the true running costs of the site with us publicly - ideally with verification or screenshots for transparency. It'd also be in your interest however exposing it is to admit how far out of pocket you are,  i know this isn't a very nice position but we all care about the site, It's very likely that most if not all of the monthly costs could be covered. I am personally happy to support if things are made clear but there needs to be an open line of communication. 

In the short-term the members should know what they will get in return from you as Admin. I understand we're all busy and something that has come up on the thread and in the past is the need for others to have admin permissions, not necessarily exactly what you have, but it would take the pressure off you and ensure the running of the site. There are a few mods on the thread that have expressed willingness. 

Once things are out in the open it'll be easier to build the future of Shybi but without this, you're struggling and there's less certainty and incentive for members to support. You don't have to be alone in this.

Thanks. 

It's the only way I can see the site going for now and I really hope she'll get on board with this.

If Admin does respond to this and open up some of you might not agree or see the point but we need to be in majority agreement regarding what changes and maintenance we want to see short-term in return for funding. I suggest a contract signed by @la-femme stating that she will see these things through as Admin.

I do feel uncomfortable suggesting it as she has supported us for so long, but truth is she's suffering for us. If we give, we deserve to know what you're getting in return. Otherwise, we might as well let her close the site for her own sake, even though I know she doesn't want that to happen, if we didn't support a few days ago it would of been reality in the short-term and it could well happen again. 

End note: I'm not doing this because I want to be Admin/anything like that. It's just once you create an audience, you're responsible and you can tell this is something I spend my life doing elsewhere and I'm passionate about it, so that's translated here .Some of you messaged me, like you're upset, angry etc. No I get off on solutions, potential, growth, vision :P Creating and changing online is a powerful thing and all of us have benefited from this site.

That said, this is about as far as I'm willing to go as an individual for now, I don't want to log on to go round in circles. Please let me know what you think off this.

I'm not really willing to go into my own personal finances right now. I don't think it's appropriate and it's a little bit invasive never mind screenshotting them.:blush:. However site costs are as follows Shybi has been hosted by Unitedhosting since 2009. It's on the 'Gold server' package listed below but paying an extra £20 per month for extra GB's of space. https://www.unitedhosting.co.uk/dedicated-hosting/managed-dedicated-servers . So yearly I've been paying roundabout £3000 a year to keep the site going and free for everyone. About £25,500.00 over the last 9 years... wow. That's really weird seeing it written down like that !  £25k...

For me it had just become a monthly bill that came out of the account every month like clockwork and I was so used to seeing it in among all the monthly bills. I didn't really think about it even when things for my own finances got tighter.. The ads in the past helped a bit, but haven't really brought anything much in for the last 3 or 4 years. They're so old and outdated now. 

While I recognise there is a need for more admin people here. Especially as I don't have the time to spend the last few months. It's always been the same old story when it comes to appointing them, like with moderators. The drama !  When someone is put into place when others don't want them there, or would like a chance themselves, or don't think they'll be any good at it. My very first co-admin here went on a massive deletion spree when she fell out with a few members.. she banned them all.  I was unaware and this went on for a period of about a year when she disliked anyone or she felt slighted by any member. It was only when I was contacted offsite that it came to my attention. We nearly lost many members who went on later to become moderators here.  Naturally, since then I have been very reluctant to invoke similar drama, or to place the site in that sort of deletion happy/suck up to Admin or else type places since then. 

But I am open to it ( all going well over the next few weeks and the site is safe ) if it can be done with little fuss and with a consensus. There's nothing worse than logging in here to see several messages all really annoyed with the latest possible moderator choice, threatening to cancel accounts if X gets picked etc etc. 

The future changes are up on the IPB forums to see. The new 4.3 is due out soon. Featuring clubs, paid memberships etc etc . This will be the direction the site is most likely going in.. a sort of mini facebook/twitter/social media platform featuring groups with different interests yet self contained within Shybi itself. I need also to pay IPB subscriptions every year. 

Lets secure the site firstly. Yes I'm willing to appoint more Admins and yes am open to ways of supporting the site financially.  Yes I'm open to changes within IPB forum software constraints. But no, I won't be singing any contracts. :)

 

 

 

 
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1 hour ago, la-femme said:

I'm not really willing to go into my own personal finances right now. I don't think it's appropriate and it's a little bit invasive never mind screenshotting them.:blush:. However site costs are as follows Shybi has been hosted by Unitedhosting since 2009. It's on the 'Gold server' package listed below but paying an extra £20 per month for extra GB's of space. https://www.unitedhosting.co.uk/dedicated-hosting/managed-dedicated-servers . So yearly I've been paying roundabout £3000 a year to keep the site going and free for everyone. About £25,500.00 over the last 9 years... wow. That's really weird seeing it written down like that !  £25k...

 

I was referencing site payments not your personal life, that would be invasive! Just so it's clear, if funding is needed. 

In terms of Admin there is the option long-term of paying someone not involved in the site for maintenance this would stop some of the drama and issues. It's something that I would be willing to back anyway. I am agreement with looking into all the other points at a later time.

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Well I can’t speak for everyone, but I’d say this is a good sign :)

@la-femme seems more than happy to look at the possibility of appointing more admins and to ways of supporting the site financially. I think those two things are the key ingredients in working torwards the future of shys. I’m glad to hear that la-femme is on board with that vision.

Edited by Cute&Curious
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Perhaps we could vote on the new admin? @BiTriMama has volunteered and I think community confidence in her is quite high, but it might be useful to have an official record of that. Certainly anybody going on a deleting spree in response to perceived slights would be an undesirable outcome.

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I agree with @ChemFem, voting might be a good idea, I’m sure there’s no way to please everyone but wouldn’t hurt knowing what the majority thinks. I second @BiTriMama, she’s well respected and I think she’d be a great addition to the admin team. I think @Hungry is a great candidate as well. Obviously @la-femme will ultimately make that decision, but I suppose we can throw our opinions out there.

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22 minutes ago, Cute&Curious said:

I agree with @ChemFem, voting might be a good idea, I’m sure there’s no way to please everyone but wouldn’t hurt knowing what the majority thinks. I second @BiTriMama, she’s well respected and I think she’d be a great addition to the admin team. I think @Hungry is a great candidate as well. Obviously @la-femme will ultimately make that decision, but I suppose we can throw our opinions out there.

 I am not up for this challenge, plus don't think @la-femme would pick me anyway. I can't see whatever happens, happen moment-to-moment here so I'm just posting a blog up on what this space and all of you have allowed for me, but now feels like time for me to jump off the island.

My pick if there is a vote @BiTriMama has always been a good contributor and I beIieve the newest mod addition, so that should go in her favor. Personally I've always found her to be kind, fair and honest. If the only reason the current admin hasn't appointed others is because they're bitchy, bratty, and risky, then I'm pretty sure she's a safe bet.

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49 minutes ago, Hungry said:

 I am not up for this challenge, plus don't think @la-femme would pick me anyway. I can't see whatever happens, happen moment-to-moment here so I'm just posting a blog up on what this space and all of you have allowed for me, but now feels like time for me to jump off the island.

My pick if there is a vote @BiTriMama has always been a good contributor and I beIieve the newest mod addition, so that should go in her favor. Personally I've always found her to be kind, fair and honest. If the only reason the current admin hasn't appointed others is because they're bitchy, bratty, and risky, then I'm pretty sure she's a safe bet.

It's not time for you to jump off the island just yet Hungry imo. The dust needs to settle first from this kick up the arse I've just gotten first, and changes need to be made. You're not surely jumping ship before things have even started in that dept ? :O Why ? 

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I think it would be good to have more than one new addition to the admin team, so that when @la-femme is unable to be here, the responsibility isn’t put on one single person. Also, a collaboration of minds can surely only be a good thing, and perhaps prevent the kind of drama la-femme mentioned above, where one person acts as a sort of dictator. And a few extra mods wouldn’t hurt either. Just my opinion of course. I’m excited for a new shybi experience :)

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11 hours ago, Cute&Curious said:

I think it would be good to have more than one new addition to the admin team, so that when @la-femme is unable to be here, the responsibility isn’t put on one single person. Also, a collaboration of minds can surely only be a good thing, and perhaps prevent the kind of drama la-femme mentioned above, where one person acts as a sort of dictator. And a few extra mods wouldn’t hurt either. Just my opinion of course. I’m excited for a new shybi experience :)

While I understand your point and agree. I also think you would need to look carefully at choices. Willingness and likablity can't be the only factors in the mix. @BiTriMama has already stated that she doesn't feel comfortable with backroom tech, so it's looking is there anyone here who is, cos you need to look at the future, there needs to be balance in the dynamic - it's why for actual maintenance and tech, it should be a paid thing, less pressure. 

Is there, any point with doing admins/mods now with the site in it's current state? If it was me, I'd hold fire. It's enough to know that admin is considering it. It's too early to draw up a poll too really. It would be worth @la-femme talking to the current mods and establishing communication there, obviously some must be long gone and have no interest but some might be happy to be active if things are on the up and new people just makes it more complicated.

Best later option: open it to a poll based on ability/other positives and any current mods who don't make the cut would hand over to the new mods on a specific date, final decision would obviously be made by admin and I think people who are newer to the site should be considered too. It sounds clique and scattered in the past for certain periods so it's gotta be about best for the site, always first and forever.

11 hours ago, la-femme said:

It's not time for you to jump off the island just yet Hungry imo. The dust needs to settle first from this kick up the arse I've just gotten first, and changes need to be made. You're not surely jumping ship before things have even started in that dept ? :O Why ? 

See the above answer as an example of when someone offers an idea or mentions something how my mind works. I'm glad you feel this is a new era for you and your involvement in the site. However, lots of these things to make the site better aren't optional, they're necessary and not every point is up for debate if you want the best outcome.  There does need to be real knowledge to run anything well, somewhere in the mix. 

I can't feel like I'm pushing all the time. It comes across as disrespectful, I've had people say to me they think I have been to you and while I think you know that's not my agenda, just in case - I'm sorry if it feels that way.

It's just for every point, there's a point which is why this thread has so many posts in such a short space of time, with very few hard facts and I'm not sure I want to witness this because it's not a pretty process. I'm not gonna agree with a lot of things both you and the members say or do and I'm not saying I'm always right, I'm not, but I don't want to go around trying to explain why and be irritated/irritate anyone. I love this site, I want it to prosper. I just don't believe I'll hold that affection if I stay. 

Edited by Hungry
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29 minutes ago, Hungry said:

While I understand your point and agree. I also think you would need to look carefully at choices. Willingness and likablity can't be the only factors in the mix. @BiTriMama has already stated that she doesn't feel comfortable with backroom tech, so it's looking is there anyone here who is, cos you need to look at the future, there needs to be balance in the dynamic - it's why for actual maintenance and tech, it should be a paid thing, less pressure. 

Is there, any point with doing admins/mods now with the site in it's current state? If it was me, I'd hold fire. It's enough to know that admin is considering it. It's too early to draw up a poll too really. It would be worth @la-femme talking to the current mods and establishing communication there, obviously some must be long gone and have no interest but some might be happy to be active if things are on the up and new people just makes it more complicated.

Yes, there are a lot of factors to consider, and that will most likely be a problem...those who have the ‘heart’ to lead this site, may not have the technical knowledge to do what needs to be done. 

I know we’re not there yet, and may not be for a while, but it couldn’t hurt to have a discussion about it now that we know it’s at least a possibility. In the end it doesn’t matter because we don’t get to make those decisions, but it’s still interesting to read other’s opinions. I think that is what this thread has become, a sort of sounding board for members to bounce around ideas and opinions and to share their vision of what the future of Shybi might look like...as well as a place for admin to provide updates and feedback as she sees necessary. However, considering that   a lot of members are choosing to opt out of this particular discussion, I’ll take that as my cue to do the same.

 

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It's really pointless to keep discussing the options and possibilities of what can be done until things are more solidified with the server and the site. Once things are stable and in la-femme's control, she can then take into account all the suggestions that have been made and decide from there.

Thank you la-femme for all the personal sacrifices that you've made over the last 13 years since the site began. I for one am grateful. I agree with you that you should be careful of who you give or share your admin duties with because it's a position that should come with respect for you as the main admin and willingness to see things from a neutral and objective point of view and only use the harsher measures to moderate if it is deemed necessary, such as filtering out men who try to disguise themselves as women and try to join the site. Also being able to deal with other things that may come up between members. I'm sure when everything becomes more stable that you'll be able to make the right decisions as to who you'd want to help you form an admin team. The good thing about you being the main admin is that if someone does do something stupid but it's not obvious to you, others can see that and make you aware of it, then you can take measures to remove them or just take away their ability to have access to those parts of the site. There's a whole different group of women that are on the site now than even 8 years ago and I'm sure there are some out of the new crew that might be willing to at least moderate. 

I'm looking forward to where the future leads the site and just a side note, there are those of us like myself, who have stayed with the site through everything and didn't give up on you or the site because it's about loyalty and friendship, not just how it can benefit you but how can it help and benefit others that struggle and have questions about their feelings.

Here's to a new and exciting future for you and for the site you created. This is your baby and like all babies the site has changed and grown but it will only get better.

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I have been following this thread since it started. As someone who only recently joined the site, I haven't felt knowledgeable enough to comment on the history or practices. However, I thought now was a good time to offer my perspective.  I am not going to claim experience with website management or the financial workings required.  I came to this site because it offered me a supportive like-minded community. The fact that it was free to join was an added bonus to me. I like that it was more private than social media since at the time I was only out to a few  friends. For me, paying a small monthly fee would be justified to keep the site running if it means the privacy that many have sought would remain in tact.  I do think that transparency should be considered if a fee is imposed. I also agree with others with the suggestion of a committee approach to site management. It would ease the burden on a single person and perhaps make a good site great. I personally don't feel I could vote for the committee since I don't have the established history.  Not sure my thoughts will change anything but there it is. :)

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19 hours ago, Bi-photo36 said:

I have been following this thread since it started. As someone who only recently joined the site, I haven't felt knowledgeable enough to comment on the history or practices. However, I thought now was a good time to offer my perspective.  I am not going to claim experience with website management or the financial workings required.  I came to this site because it offered me a supportive like-minded community. The fact that it was free to join was an added bonus to me. I like that it was more private than social media since at the time I was only out to a few  friends. For me, paying a small monthly fee would be justified to keep the site running if it means the privacy that many have sought would remain in tact.  I do think that transparency should be considered if a fee is imposed. I also agree with others with the suggestion of a committee approach to site management. It would ease the burden on a single person and perhaps make a good site great. I personally don't feel I could vote for the committee since I don't have the established history.  Not sure my thoughts will change anything but there it is. :)

I think it’s important to consider what new members think, too, because it takes having new people joining for the site to stay alive.  Just as there are active veteran members, there are active new members, and we need to be able to draw new members in.

I totally agree that an admin team would be great, hopefully with a mix of strengths.  Since we ALL have lives outside this site, I have to imagine it’s a lot for any one person to manage at this point.

Like what @wolfbigrl88 said, part of what I love about this site is being able to help others who are struggling.  Over the years we’ve seen several members just blossom and come out of bad situations or just realize who they really are and grow to be okay with that and eventually meet the right woman.  This is a tight knit community, one that I can’t imagine would be matched anywhere else for this subject matter, and certainly not as welcoming of new members.

At this point, @la-femme, what would be helpful from us to keep things going and to take some of the load off your plate?

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I've been reading along with the posts but haven't really said anything, but I am listening to all the suggestions and seeing everyone pull together. That's the community I signed up for all those years ago. I saw what a great bunch of ladies shybi attracted and how they grouped together to support each other as well as the site. I hope we can use that spirit and drive to save this special site. It does need work, and I'm willing to help where I can. 

Part of the reason I left was due to personal issues but at the same time I saw the site become something I didn't recognise anymore. I am a moderator and so I heard of everyone's worries and concerns and yet felt helpless to do anything about it. I felt my presence here wasn't needed because I couldn't protect the ladies here desperately seeking somewhere safe and protected to be open about something very sensitive and private. 

I am grateful to La Femme for everything she has done over the years to keep this place afloat. I'm grateful for her site for pulling me from a very dark place that I never thought I'd escape from. I'm grateful for this place for giving me something I love and cherish the most in my life. This place deserves my time and my help if it goes in the right direction. I don't want any kind of recognition but I donated to help keep the site alive, despite my absence I believe in this place and would be sad to see anything happen to it. It has such great potential to be even better than it is or ever was.

I volunteer any time or resources I can offer in order to make this happen. I also agree that @BiTriMama is an excellent candidate for more responsibility if that's something she wants. Although one of our newest mods who I've only just started to talk to I'm fully confident in her abilities and trust her to be fair and impartial. Thanks to her this place still has a mod around. 

I'll be lurking in the shadows anyway and when whatever has to be done starts to happen I'm willing to be more on board if that's what the site needs.

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I'm going to climb up on my high horse and say things some are unlikely to want to hear. None of the following should be taken personally. This is not a personal attack on either @la-femme or the Mods and should not be taken as such. It comes from my experience and observation. To give this some context, I have both Administered and Moderated forums for 20+ years. I know how they work and have experienced how they fail. -

Thanks to Facebook, many forums are dead or dying. Shybi is fortunate in the era of social media to still be relevant and attract sufficient traffic to remain viable. It has that special "something" despite the current poor layout of the site and yes, the quality and value of discussion has fallen significantly in recent times (which likely explains the loss of many longer term members), yet the site continues to attract new members.

If Shybi fails, it will be from the inside out:

Ongoing funding is clearly an issue to which there are a number of possible solutions. An issue that I'm not going to attempt to address here - sorry.

Day to day operation of the site is what I would like to address and there are a couple of appropriate aphorisms:

Quote

 

Too many cooks spoil the broth.

A camel is a horse designed by a committee.

 

A forum is not a democracy. It is the personal universe of the site owner... and Admin is Queen Bitch of the Universe! She sets the laws which all of us have to abide by.

A successful forum requires leadership from an Administrator who is present, active and has vision for the future direction of the site. Administration is not a straightforward task. The back-end operation of the forum is quite technical and it is very easy to do a lot of damage, intentionally or not. The Administrator who is usually the site owner, has a personal idea of what the site should be and relinquishing a degree of control requires an extreme level of trust in the person chosen. @la-femme has experience of giving Admin status to the wrong person and is rightly wary of appointing anyone else.

Moderation is a thankless task with no real job description, taken on by volunteers. But and it is a big but, if you do step up you must be willing to be present, do the job impartially and to the best of your ability. If you don't have the time and can not be present or impartial, don't volunteer. If you are currently a Mod and don't have the time or can not be present or impartial, step down graciously. Admin must also be willing to dismiss ineffective or disruptive Mods. There will always be disagreements among any group of people and the worst thing for the membership is to see infighting among the Mods. There have been times when it has been all too obvious that all is not well in the Moderation team. Keeping the number of Moderators to the smallest workable number is perhaps the best way to keep disagreements to a minimum. Moderating the Moderators is one of the Administrator's most important functions!

 

That's all. Climbing down off my horse now...

:blush2:

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@Golightly63 one thing you mentioned was declining quality of content. That's something everyday members can directly impact. What would you say are the sorts of things you would like to see more of on the site? Whether it's making new threads or resurrecting old ones, this seems like one of the things we have the most direct control over.

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If I had all the answers, life would be a breeze. :wink: New topics, of course. Continuing older topics if they remain relevant.

While not wishing to be a total killjoy, less of the entirely frivolous content - the never ending this that and the other topics. Sometimes these topics are all the site appears to consist of and that's not (or at least I hope that's not) what potential and new members are looking for.

I know I'm not unique in sometimes wondering why I continue to visit Shybi. I watch and read but do not often post these days, as I see little opportunity to contribute to the conversation.

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14 minutes ago, Golightly63 said:

If I had all the answers, life would be a breeze. :wink: New topics, of course. Continuing older topics if they remain relevant.

While not wishing to be a total killjoy, less of the entirely frivolous content - the never ending this that and the other topics. Sometimes these topics are all the site appears to consist of and that's not (or at least I hope that's not) what potential and new members are looking for.

I know I'm not unique in sometimes wondering why I continue to visit Shybi. I watch and read but do not often post these days, as I see little opportunity to contribute to the conversation.

^^ Seconded!

I've been kicking around on forums (and at times running them) since the late 90s, and "word association" etc topics have always existed as a "post count pump and dump" for people, but when it's the majority of your active content, then it's a bad sign. The next highest traffic topics here seem to me to be the sexual conversations. Whilst I'm not averse to that myself, it could put some people off and it doesn't bode well for serious topics. 

Perhaps there just isn't the volume of active membership to sustain 'proper' discussions? Everyone has their own interests, and when you don't have enough people, you won't get the numbers needed to generate interesting conversations on a range of different topics as not enough people find it relevant to them. This is something that could be addressed with an appropriate comms and engagement plan - targeted posts on social media, getting a couple of influencers on board, reaching out to LGBT organisations/charities etc etc 

There are things that can be done, but it won't be a quick and easy fix.

I've not been around long, but I'd be gutted if this place was no more.

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On 16/02/2018 at 6:22 PM, Golightly63 said:

 

A forum is not a democracy. It is the personal universe of the site owner... and Admin is Queen Bitch of the Universe! She sets the laws which all of us have to abide by.

^^^ this was so well put! Whahahahaha!!!

I just have to add:

Yes. Amen! 

 

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On 16/02/2018 at 6:50 PM, ThatsNoMoon said:

Perhaps there just isn't the volume of active membership to sustain 'proper' discussions? Everyone has their own interests, and when you don't have enough people, you won't get the numbers needed to generate interesting conversations on a range of different topics as not enough people find it relevant to them. This is something that could be addressed with an appropriate comms and engagement plan - targeted posts on social media, getting a couple of influencers on board, reaching out to LGBT organisations/charities etc etc

With every respect to where you are coming from, I tend to disagree. Some of the actual hatred and bigotry comes from well within LGBT groups and it seems it is usually the B bit that gets erased, trashed or insulted. This is essentially a bi site for women. We need to support all women but have zero tolerance for anyone who singles out bisexual women for abuse or back handed insults wrapped up in humour. There is a B in LGBT and I think this site is likely the only one who fully supports folks not being out and helping them find their way. It is up to the LGT bit to get over themselves sometimes and accept bi folk as having every right to exists and be themselves. It is not a phase. It is a genuine sexuality and if some lesbians cannot accept that then it is their loss to be honest. I am a gay woman but I wholly support bi folk for who they are.

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On 3/3/2018 at 6:47 AM, lilac_lover said:

With every respect to where you are coming from, I tend to disagree. Some of the actual hatred and bigotry comes from well within LGBT groups and it seems it is usually the B bit that gets erased, trashed or insulted. This is essentially a bi site for women. We need to support all women but have zero tolerance for anyone who singles out bisexual women for abuse or back handed insults wrapped up in humour. There is a B in LGBT and I think this site is likely the only one who fully supports folks not being out and helping them find their way. It is up to the LGT bit to get over themselves sometimes and accept bi folk as having every right to exists and be themselves. It is not a phase. It is a genuine sexuality and if some lesbians cannot accept that then it is their loss to be honest. I am a gay woman but I wholly support bi folk for who they are.

Heartily seconded. Unfortunately many who are just L or G (I've found trans people more affirming) consider bisexuals a distraction whose needs are not as really as theirs. This despite many statistics showing that adverse outcomes like substance abuse and suicidal ideation are more common in bi people than gay people. I've been out for a couple years but I didn't stop feeling like a poor relation of the queer community till I joined ShyBi.

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Is there any new news or info on this? I haven't seen or heard anything about it so I thought I would ask.  No change won't work,  for long..... so I'm just curious as to what is being done?

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Is there any new news or info on this? I haven't seen or heard anything about it so I thought I would ask.  No change won't work,  for long..... so I'm just curious as to what is being done?

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Is there any new news or info on this? I haven't seen or heard anything about it so I thought I would ask.  No change won't work,  for long..... so I'm just curious as to what is being done?

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Is there any new news or info on this? I haven't seen or heard anything about it so I thought I would ask.  No change won't work,  for long..... so I'm just curious as to what is being done?

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